Peer Support Fundamentals with Tim Rutledge

In this episode, we talk with Tim Rutledge. Tim has an extensive history working in law enforcement and is the lead instructor for LEAPS (Law Enforcement Alliance for Peer Support. Please tune in to hear Tim talk about peer support, the purpose, and the mission behind LEAPS. If you want to know more about peer support, this episode is for you.

If you would like more information about LEAPS or need someone to talk to, check out the information below:

LEAPS-Website

Tim Rutledge-(601)955-0055

Vern Phillips-(352)789-9077

Transcript

Critical Aspects Podcast (00:00.974)

All right, welcome back to critical aspects of law enforcement. I'm your host Vernon Phillips. And today we are joined on the show with Tim Rutledge. So I'm just going to give it over to him. He's going to explain a little bit about himself, his, uh, just kind of his history in law enforcement, what he's doing now and how he is, um, you know, effectively changing the culture that we know. So Tim, go ahead.

Tim Rutledge (00:21.934)

I hope I'm changing the culture, but I'm only the messenger. My career started January 3rd, 1980. I was a junior college campus policeman, sworn bonded in commission, given a gun at 18 years old, spooky. I was grandfathered in by Mississippi's Post Act at 19, grandfathered at 19. Then I joined the Bureau of Narcotics a couple of years later, retired from there in 2009. Then I went to work.

Critical Aspects Podcast (00:23.806)

Hehehehe

Tim Rutledge (00:49.07)

for a place called the RCTA. It's a DOD entity that trains law enforcement. There are five of these schools around the country. I was director of one of them. And then I created my company to do peer support across the country. It has expanded significantly and we're getting a message out of peer support that hasn't been to audiences that have not been reached. And I'm blessed to be a part of it, absolutely.

Critical Aspects Podcast (01:18.802)

Well, it sounds like you've got an extensive history in law enforcement, and then also now you're kind of one of the ones leading the way as far as peer support goes. And I wanna talk about that, that's primarily what we wanna talk about in this episode, but I just wanna talk a little bit about your career. And as you look back over your career, what did you do for yourself to maintain just your physical, mental, emotional, and spiritual health throughout your career? I mean, we're talking 30 plus years, so.

Tim Rutledge (01:49.058)

Yeah, primarily it was based on faith and my religion got me through a lot of bad times. And then about 1991, we discovered peer support kind of accidentally. And there were the critical incident stress management models out there. But we did that for a while, but we realized we were just sitting around waiting on something bad to happen. We weren't really taking care of each other.

And so we created LEAPS, the Law Enforcement Alliance for Pure Support. And it means that we take care of when an officer has a sick child in the hospital, we help that officer, we help them get the other children to school, or we help them financially if absolutely necessary. Now, if a cop goes out and buys a brand new 2024 Escalade, I'm not going to help him pay for it. But if a tornado hits his house, we're going to find payment mechanisms to help.

If they fall through financial insecurities through no fault of their own, we'll help them. And illnesses and death of parents and the host of life that happens, the host of other things that happen in life that are just devastating that aren't directly related to the job, peer support does that. CISM does not. And

So it's an expansion, it's a progression, it's a graduation, if you will, from CISM. And CISM is important and is an important part of peer support. But probably we deal with relationship issues more than any other issue. And we'll talk about that shortly. But if I went through the woes of being a law enforcement officer, like having a life expectancy of 59, being the highest rate of suicide there is having a very high divorce rate with high domestic abuse. I disagree with the national numbers on domestic abuse, but I know we have a high rate. Alcoholism, twice at the national average. And then we add pharmaceuticals and pharmaceutical dependents. And then as a cop, you're 73 times more likely to be assaulted with injury than the number two occupation we measure assaults in, taxi cab drivers. And we had...

Tim Rutledge (04:11.306)

331 officers shot last year and it does look like this year will be another record, unfortunately. We're online to have a record year of number of officers shot. Fortunately, the number of officers dying from gunfire is down from last year. I think that's because of vest and tactics and modern medicine, but we're getting shot in record numbers. It's a dangerous world out there.

Critical Aspects Podcast (04:38.802)

Yeah, absolutely for sure.

Tim Rutledge (04:39.23)

Very dangerous. And so all those reasons are why we created the real peer support mechanism about 2003. And we've been doing that since, and it's been great, been a blessing to be a part of.

Critical Aspects Podcast (04:55.098)

Yeah, absolutely. I'm sure. So as you kind of look back over your career, what are kind of three of the most significant things that you've learned throughout your career?

Tim Rutledge (05:09.366)

Well, yeah a little bit. I, number one, I outgrew my ego eventually. I was the smartest guy in the world when I was 28 years old. And I learned eventually I wasn't so smart. And now the more I learn, the less I know. And number two, it was fun to be a drug agent in the 80s and 90s. I mean that's when drugs were still sexy.

Critical Aspects Podcast (05:10.331)

Making you think now.

Tim Rutledge (05:35.546)

She's got bags under her eyes now, and she's got gray hair and wrinkles. But drugs are still the number one killer of all out there. I think vehicle accidents killed about 55,000. We had more than 110,000 drug overdose deaths last year. So drugs are still the number one culprit of crime and death on the street.

So unfortunately, we're not addressing the drug issue. But I had fun, it was just fun. And wanted to go to work every day, actually one of those type that never worked a day in my life, still haven't. It's been fun. Yes, we had administrative woes, we had persecution from bad bosses, we had all that. But you learn to get through that, you learn to overlook that. And three, I would say,

I learned to put my family first eventually. I did the wire taps for the Bureau of Narcotics. My son's first year of his life, I spent 155 nights away from him. I still keep a diary, a daily diary, from September 18th, 1983. I can tell you where I was and who I was with and what I was doing. And when I looked at that diary at the end of the first year, 155 nights away from my infant son, I realized he was gonna grow up without me.

So I made those changes to spend time with family. And I absolutely do not regret that. Absolutely one of the best decisions I've made. So that's three off the top of my head. I don't know if that's what you're looking for, but.

Critical Aspects Podcast (07:10.834)

No, absolutely. I mean, because those are the real tangible takeaways that maybe some people don't even want to talk about. But I think learning to putting your family first, I think that's one thing that a lot in law enforcement today and this first responder community in general don't really put a lot of stake in. There's always going to be more demand. And the thing is, the more things you volunteer for, the more things you put your hand involved in, the more that is going to be demanded of you the more that your agency or department will take. And so educating those that are in the law enforcement community right now who are still – they got their boots on the ground that are looking for that next step, looking for that next promotion, a lot of times the family dynamic falls second to the career. And I've made that myself too where I've said, well, I've just got to do – this is just until I get to this point then you get to that point and then it's like, well, I've got to do this and I've got to work these hours just until I get to this point. There's always going to be another point. There's always going to be another push. There's always going to be another reason why you have to be putting in long hours. You have to be away from your family, but to be able to recognize it and step back, and for you, I think documenting it out and then realizing like, man, this is the amount of time I was away from my son in the first year of his life. If I continue to do this,

I'm going to be an absent father. I think that's what we don't talk about. We don't really push that to some of the newcomers like, hey, look, make sure that you are putting that focus and that effort into your family because when the career is gone, hopefully your family is still going to be the one that's there. That's what we want. Those are great takeaways. Those are great practical things that we need to start.

Tim Rutledge (08:40.879)

Or...

Tim Rutledge (08:59.371)

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

Critical Aspects Podcast (09:07.718)

in parting in on the new generation coming in.

Tim Rutledge (09:12.866)

And of course we didn't have cell phones back then. So now even when you're with kids these days, you're buried in your cell phone. I'm gonna challenge these guys to put the freaking phone down. I enjoy your kids. I had a conversation yesterday with a cop and you really only get about eight Halloweens and they don't do that anymore. That's it. And you only get 18 birthdays and they're gone. And after about six, age of 16, when they start driving,

Critical Aspects Podcast (09:20.569)

Hmm

Tim Rutledge (09:41.59)

You really never see them again. So enjoy your children, spend time with them, hold their hand, play with them, get engaged physically with them, playing ball and having a tea party and whatever, but engage with your children is my plea. You will not regret it. You'll be close to them all your life if you do.

Critical Aspects Podcast (10:03.298)

Yeah, and that's just practical advice. And I can sit here and agree with you on that because I try to implement things in my life, right? To where I'm making sure that I'm giving time to my family. But even with that, even with the current position I hold, there's always a phone call, there's always a text, there's always something going on. Just recently, Tim, you know my wife, Laurie, so she...

We had a very authentic conversation and she made the comment to me that, hey, you're home, but sometimes when you're home, you're on your phone and you're not home. And that was real, right? That was a real moment where I was like, man. So she sees this. She sees the implication of how much that phone can become a part of who you are. But the phone is not who you are.

Tim Rutledge (10:58.915)

What?

Critical Aspects Podcast (11:00.242)

The phone is a tool, it's not you.

Tim Rutledge (11:02.798)

But let me defend you just a little bit, Vern. We cops, we get addicted to adrenaline. And I'm reading studies now about adrenaline therapy, treating PTSD and other trauma. But we get addicted to the adrenaline. And this phone is a link to that adrenaline at work. And so I'll defend you. It's hard to put the phone down. I mean, it's hard for the brain to turn this thing off.

Critical Aspects Podcast (11:06.163)

Hahaha.

Critical Aspects Podcast (11:29.63)

Oh yeah.

Tim Rutledge (11:31.734)

So I'm begging the cops out there that might listen to this to make a conscious effort. When you're on your couch or your recliner looking at your phone and your kids are at home, I'm going to challenge you to put your phone down. Have a conscious thought. I shouldn't be doing this now. Until the kids go to bed. And then after the kids go to bed, you've got to have a conversation with your partner. A real conversation. And we'll talk about how to do that shortly. But instead of asking how your day was.

I love this statement, name three good things that happened to you today. That requires process and dialogue. Name three bad things that happened to you today. That requires process and dialogue. And you can immediately get to bad things that happened that day with your partner and begin to address them or at least console them. One of the things we teach in a family class.

Critical Aspects Podcast (12:27.594)

Yep, and we could sit here and kind of go back and forth about some of this stuff, and never really get into the aspect of peer support. So, no, I'm the one kind of pushing the question. So, when we start looking at peer support and what you're doing and Leaps, so you've already kind of explained just a little bit what Leaps is and how it came about and the development. So right now,

Tim Rutledge (12:36.106)

Right. Sorry.

Critical Aspects Podcast (12:55.686)

What is Leaps doing and kind of just what is the overview of what you guys are teaching law enforcement and peer support members, how to effectively engage other peers.

Tim Rutledge (13:08.906)

We are now expanding. We began in Mississippi with one person, and now we have more than 3,000 weeks members across the country. I was in Albuquerque, New Mexico last week. And the message is simple that we're expanding. Take care of each other. And it's not, again, waiting for a critical incident to happen and doing a quick response and then maybe some follow-up, and then that's it. It's real peer support about their life. Now the job is a big part of the life.

The job bonds us together. The job gives us credibility with peer support, but most of our issues aren't related to the job. In classes, we require the student answer this question. What is the worst thing you've been through in your life? And they answer that publicly. 90% of the answers to that question, what is the worst thing you've been through in your life, are not law enforcement stories. They're.

There are stories, for example, 15 to 20% of the participants in our classes were sexually abused as children. And that is why they're in law enforcement. It's a great motivation. This happened to me, so I'm going to address this as an adult and as a cop, and I'm gonna do something about it. A lot of physical abuse, a lot of current domestic abuse that they're the victim or survivor of, if you will, particularly when female officers and that needs to be addressed. We're addressing that. And then the message of suicide and suicide recognition and prevention is something that we're touting in the classes and leaps across the country. Very few people have discussed this and it is our number one killer. There's about a two and a half times greater chance you will be, you'll kill yourself than that you will be killed by a bad guy. And we're just simply not really addressing that. What does a suicidal of a cop look like and what do I do about it? We're not addressing that nationally. Several people are beginning to, Karen Solomon at Blue Help created that mechanism probably 10 years ago. It's beginning to come into the limelight, but it's still a taboo topic generally. And then we have cops that really aren't fit to be a cop. I mean, they really have.

Tim Rutledge (15:34.402)

Mental issues themselves. We teach how to recognize that in these classes. And then, of course, a lot of duty deaths and grief in general. Another taboo topic. We don't talk about death. We're afraid to. And so we address that in the class. Also involves shooting. Section covers the whole gambit of what trauma does to the body before, during and after.

We take shootings as an example, but most officers won't be involved in a shooting. Still, although we're shooting more people than we ever have, there's still a good chance you'll never be in a shooting in your career, and I hope you're not. And then we go back to the family issue. We're not addressing that. We don't talk about things like sex. Instead, we let the television commercials and the internet teach us what sex is supposed to be, and it's obviously not what sex is supposed to be. We teach what sex should be in a relationship. So those are things that LEAPS are doing across the country and it's a big hit. A lot of teams have done what they call peer support, but inevitably it was just a critical incident response. It's not real peer support. Until you address the non-law enforcement issues, it's not peer support. So that's where LEAPS is. Again, we've got a little more than three thousand officers that we trained.

And the idea of LEAPS is when you have an officer in Ocala, Florida, shoot a 17 year old kid. We have a cop in Biloxi, Mississippi, and in Longview, Texas, that have been involved in shooting juveniles before that's been trained in peer support. And we can link the two together via phone or via a video mechanism. And when the conversation is done, no one knows it ever happened. That's the idea of peer support.

Critical Aspects Podcast (17:33.062)

Yeah, because the whole idea of peer support is founded on the confidentiality aspect of having those conversations, having those one-on-one conversations where people actually feel they have the ability to just share the struggles and the things they're dealing with and the things they're going through without the potential likelihood that it's going to end up on Facebook or end up on the desk of somebody else that doesn't need to know.

Critical Aspects Podcast (18:06.671)

So I've gone through your class twice now, and actually, well, I mean, I would probably almost say maybe three times. So I mean, you teach a lot of stuff, you teach a lot of really good practical things to law enforcement that, which is like you said, that we don't talk about. Oftentimes we don't really talk about the family dynamic and just what that looks like.

Tim Rutledge (18:09.474)

wise.

Tim Rutledge (18:14.25)

Are you right? It has been three times.

Critical Aspects Podcast (18:33.978)

outside of the profession and how the profession, puts the stress on that, but then just the outside stress just of having family in general and having relationships outside of the career. So when you kind of are teaching and you're implementing this, how do you go about, or how would you, somebody who's a peer support member, how would you encourage them to actively engage in somebody's life, not just in a response to a critical incident or after a critical incident. Maybe they're going through a hard time, maybe their marriage is going through a rough spot and you're aware of it and other people are aware of it, but they haven't reached out and asked for help. What would you say is the best practice for a peer support member to step into that and maybe just offer some assistance?

Tim Rutledge (19:27.542)

That's actually the easy part. Once you've established a reputation that you know, one, you'll keep your mouth shut, that you're trustworthy and that you actually care, the cops will come to you, they'll fall to you. And if they don't, if you hear their father or mother died, or they have a child in the hospital, you just go see them. Hey, how you doing? So your child's sick. Uh, and if that child has a, uh, serious disease, we have

cops on our team that have had children with serious diseases before, and we can put them together. But for that cop out there doing peer support, if they see your genuine compassion, they'll come to you. The core of peer support should always be meeting a cop at 6 a.m. shift change or 2 a.m. behind a store while they're out on patrol, helping them significantly, talking to them, leaving and no one knows the meeting ever happened. That should be the core peer support. No recognition, no award, no statistic, no notes, no nothing. Just help the cops and move on. And we've learned an old Alcoholics Anonymous cliche, you're only as sick as your secrets. And when we talk to cops and get secrets out, we heal them or actually they heal themselves. We're just the mechanism for that, but we're honored to be the mechanism. That's what peer support should be, just taking care of each other.

Critical Aspects Podcast (21:04.178)

So it's establishing that credibility with them that they know, hey, if I'm in a situation, I can come and talk to this individual. And it takes a while to create that. That's not something that just gets established overnight. It's something that they need to see through and through and through, over the course of sometimes, months, maybe even years for some people to really be able to create that trust to feel like, hey, this is somebody I can talk to and unfortunately, I mean, you know, that's not with everybody.

Tim Rutledge (21:38.862)

That's right. And, you know, as the old saying goes, you can lead a horse to water. There will be cops that you know that need help. You'll go to them and they'll say, I'm good. I'm fine. I've got this. But they're the same person that's going to call you at two o'clock in the morning, two years from now, when they have a gun to their head. So you plant the seeds, they will come. I promise you that.

Critical Aspects Podcast (22:04.646)

And when we start talking about peer support and interacting with somebody else, how common is it for a peer support provider, a peer support team member to interact with another peer on one or two occasions and then maybe not have any more interaction because now the crisis in that peer's life has been averted or they feel like now they're moving on how often you think that takes place where it's just maybe one or two and then they kind of fade off. Once the crisis is averted, we're back to normal.

Tim Rutledge (22:43.018)

It's actually very common. And cops just want to be well enough to get the job done. And once we get them to that point, they're good. They'll call next time or we'll see them next time. I wish there was a way to get the message that if we really are here for everyone and everything, they will see that eventually maybe. But. You know, we've been around since 2003 in Mississippi, and we still have officers out there that have never heard of us, never even heard of us before. So I think, if I were really concerned about marketing, I would be doing something different, but it's not about me. I've learned that. It's about the cops out there. So if we keep focused on them, I thought-

think we'll be fine. And I think peer support teams generally get good. Well, they begin to base their program on their own ego. I've seen those programs come and go across the country. One person wants to control it. One person wants to dictate who and who does not go and when they go and when they don't go to take care of a cop. We've learned self deployment is the answer. If you hear something bad happening, go here. An author needs help. Go and

Most of the time I don't even hear about it as head of the team in Mississippi. And that's what I want. I just want the Cuff to be better.

Critical Aspects Podcast (24:16.434)

Yeah, and I think the culture... Sorry, go ahead, Tim.

Tim Rutledge (24:16.739)

So.

Well, I'm just wondering if we were to ask your audience what is their number one issue in life? Some would say the job, but I'm thinking most, I'm going back to the family relationship thing. Most of that is on relationships and critical incident stress management doesn't really address relationships at all. And those relationships, the number one reason we die from suicide is relationship issues.

So they go hand in hand actually. So I think your officers out there listening to this will acknowledge that they haven't, they've never had a family class. They've never had anyone come in and say, this is how you manage your family, that yes, this is how you're different as a law enforcement officer, and this is what you do about it. And a host of people could do that training for them, a host of them. The fundamentals are the fundamentals. When a major league baseball player practices baseball.

He puts his ball on a tee like we did when we were six years old, and he practices his grip on the bat, his weight shift, the swing, the follow through. He practices that on a tee because the fundamentals are the fundamentals. And there are a host of people out there that could teach the fundamentals of a relationship. And some of them are even have significant law enforcement experience. So find them and make that happen. I'm begging your audience out there to focus on family and relationships.

Critical Aspects Podcast (25:55.43)

Yeah, I think there's a lot of law enforcement, and you've touched on this, they're really good at doing their job and interacting with people in the community, and they have no issue being the first on scene, the first one through the door, the first one putting themselves in harm way to address whatever the threat is in front of them or to kind of be that mediator between, maybe there's a domestic, but.

They go home and they have no real practical skills or instruction on how to effectively interact with their own family. And they're more than willing to jump in and help somebody else on the outside throughout their career. But when it comes to their own home, their own life, their own family, they just, now oftentimes they don't do anything, right?

Tim Rutledge (26:54.334)

Absolutely.

Critical Aspects Podcast (26:55.227)

And eventually what happens is you see that end in maybe some type of domestic where then that causes the officer to get himself hemmed up and in trouble and maybe there's a separation from the job or ends up in divorce or ends up in just nasty custody battles and just he said, she said things.

Tim Rutledge (27:18.47)

Absolutely. And what we do on the street does not work at home. An officer gets to family disturbance, he'll point his finger, say shut up, one more word you're going to jail. We can even threaten to arrest people in a domestic to get people to talk to us. That does not work at home. And again, if an officer has no training in what to do at home, he's going to revert back to his training or her training, what they know on the street. And that gets us in trouble.

Critical Aspects Podcast (27:23.464)

No.

Tim Rutledge (27:48.17)

Causes serious relationship issues obviously. So a little bit of training would go a long way. It will.

Critical Aspects Podcast (27:58.246)

We're working on something here for, after the first part of the year, we're gonna be doing a marriage conference, marriage summit. We're probably done in two nights. We'll do, so that we can hit both companies, but just kind of a practical way to...

Tim Rutledge (28:13.027)

Great.

Critical Aspects Podcast (28:21.562)

Address some of these issues, right? Some of these things that we have going on. So, you know, we're looking at doing just a, hey, this is the law enforcement career. This is what it looks like. These are the things that your significant other interacts with each and every day. Because a lot of times the family, and especially the significant other, they don't really have a whole grasp on what their law enforcement officer does, right? Day in and day out, some of the things that they deal with. So kind of giving them just this general overview, but then also giving them tangible ways, hey, look, this is how you guys can effectively communicate. These are some good ideas, and then, you know, we're gonna go into a panel of individuals that have worked in law enforcement, that are married and, you know, and even have been divorced and since remarried that can actually talk and say, hey, look, this is what we've done that works. This is what does not work. Just to kind of give them that that actual tangible, look it can be done, you just have to put the time and the effort into it and it's hard, right? You know this, I know this, that marriage is not easy. As soon as you get married, it's not like this automatic pass go where everything's gonna be smooth from there. A lot of times there's.

Tim Rutledge (29:29.682)

It is very hard.

Tim Rutledge (29:44.223)

Far from it, right?

Critical Aspects Podcast (29:45.542)

Yeah, well a lot of times, you know, there's issues going into the marriage and a lot of times people think in their mind that, well, once we're married, this will just go away. No, generally, if there's things that are happening going into the marriage, they're just going to be exacerbated once you do get married. So make sure that you're putting in the work, make sure you're addressing the things that are going on, make sure you're having those communications and learn good effective ways to communicate.

You talk about that in your course, you talk about that in your training, and that's one of the blocks that you do utilize and you do have in there. But I think that some people don't understand or they have a hard time actually knowing when to step into somebody's life. And so as a peer support team member, if you're a peer support team member, what are some of the tips that you can use?

Tim Rutledge (30:37.11)

Right.

Critical Aspects Podcast (30:44.682)

That you would give for just kind of stepping into somebody's life when you're really unsure of, okay, not sure if they want me, I mean, because it's kind of like me interjecting myself, but if they see something, if they know something, and maybe they're not quite .. Maybe they're a newer deputy or maybe they don't know this individual very well, what would your suggestions be on that?

Tim Rutledge (31:07.378)

Well, number one, humility is key and understand not everybody likes you. And it's hard. It's hard for me to understand nobody. Somebody might not like me, but, um, you can offer. And, uh, very privately whisper with a low tone. Let me help you through this. I can meet you anywhere day or night, plant that seed and let them, uh, leave it on them.

Critical Aspects Podcast (31:17.037)

Ha ha ha!

Tim Rutledge (31:36.106)

You can't force yourself on anyone. And chaplains, I've seen chaplains trying to push themselves and push themselves and push themselves. And every time they push, those cops are gonna retreat even further. Plant the seed, let it grow. They will come. If you build it, they will come, of course. And they will come eventually. And I'm guessing I may get some phone calls. I'll get my number out. I may get some phone calls from this podcast.

If I can help a cop anywhere that might be listening to this I am 24 7 for you about any issue you want to talk about now I don't like talking to drunk cops at midnight But I will if you have a real issue I will absolutely help you any way I can and I know Vern has the same attitude for anybody listening to this Vern is 24 7 for you Please call one of us will help you significantly. I promise you and wit well

We'll show you how to help yourself significantly.

Critical Aspects Podcast (32:38.81)

And if you want to, Tim, I can add the information for leaps in the show notes. And if you want me to put your number in there, I can do that. And that's the thing is, yeah, go ahead. Hey.

Tim Rutledge (32:46.698)

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Absolutely. And again, I'm sorry, I keep cutting you off, but they hear my voice and for whatever reason they don't like me, you can text me and I'll put you in touch with a cop that you will like. We'll find one out of the 3000 we have in 17, 18 states. There's got to be somebody that can help you and no one will ever, not even me, unless you talk to me, no one will ever know. No one outside of the two of you will ever know.

That's just how it should be.

Critical Aspects Podcast (33:20.37)

Yep, and so I'll put that in there and that's important. It's just people knowing that there is somebody there that you can always reach out to, you can always call. And some people make use of that and some people don't. I mean, even in my position, and Tim, I think we've talked about this before, offline, is even where I'm at, there's times where people just, they just wanna struggle. They don't want any outside.

You know anybody kind of stepping in and helping them and you can only do you know You can only do so much you can you can only offer so much and at one at you know at some point you just you know, you kind of got to step back and You know and let give them that space but Don't allow it to become something where you're like, well, you know what fine screw you. You don't want my help. Whatever. I'm done Because that's not the point right? The point is you know you're there because you want to help somebody else. And if they're not there, if they're not to that point, then they just step back and they might get to that point and then they might reach out. But if it goes right into the attitude, it was like, hey, I was here to help you and you didn't want my help, so whatever, kick rocks. That's not the attitude, right? That's not the peer support model that you're pushing or that you even want. So you want people that are gonna be available. Go ahead, Tim.

Tim Rutledge (34:35.015)

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.

Tim Rutledge (34:40.629)

Absolutely not.

Tim Rutledge (34:44.706)

And we absolutely, well, and we understand that, you know, a lot of cops were sexually, physically, emotionally abused as children and the pain is all they know. They think this is what life is and they don't know that there's a better life when you get this stuff out of your head, out of your heart, when you share secrets with someone. They don't know how much better you can be and how much better life can be.

Critical Aspects Podcast (34:58.207)

Mm-hmm.

Tim Rutledge (35:11.55)

So hopefully we'll get the opportunity to expose a little bit of that to someone and they'll want more and who knows they'll join the peer support and pass it on to other cops in the future. I cannot forget dispatchers. Often they are more traumatized than we are and especially when a cop is hurt often they're much more traumatized than we are so please know that if you're a dispatcher out there listening to this communications officer excuse me.

We're available to you too and we have several hundred communication officers that are available. I can put you together with communication officers from Charlotte to Texas to Albuquerque to everywhere in between and we can get you some help and no one will ever know.

Critical Aspects Podcast (36:02.122)

That's great. And what I'll do is, yep, go ahead.

Tim Rutledge (36:06.442)

Well, I just got to add this to there is no fee or money involved in any way whatsoever with any of this. I'm not in it. We're not in this for the money. I don't know anybody doing peer support for money. It wouldn't last very long. But we are in this just for the soul of the officer and the dispatcher. That's why we're in this.

Critical Aspects Podcast (36:25.555)

Yeah.

Critical Aspects Podcast (36:29.162)

So I want to just give you an opportunity just so if somebody wants to research leaps and research kind of what that looks like and just tell them kind of where they can find that and I'll put all this in the show notes also. And then also maybe some of the upcoming trainings that you do have and kind of where you're going to be throughout the rest of this year and maybe into the first part of next year.

Tim Rutledge (36:53.91)

Well, I will be in Atlanta for a couple of weeks for the Atlanta Police Department. They're requiring every sergeant and up, including Chief Darren Schirrbaum, to attend this class and he has attended the class. It's changed the culture of the Atlanta Police Department. I will be in Baton Rouge, Louisiana doing an advance and I train the trainer in February. In between I have about four or five classes, two in Mississippi here.

I have officer involved shooting classes in North and South Carolina. We have a police benevolent association, the Southern States PBA. We're doing one day suicide and PTSD seminars across the Southeast. You can go to PBA website for that. Our website is msleeps.org. The Alabama's website is alleeps.org.

Tim Rutledge (37:52.366)

And you can find information about classes and individual peer support there. We're still waiting on someone to create like FL leaps, Vern, in all your spare time, in all your spare time. We are simply an alliance. Well you can tell. But we are not looking to take over any team. We're just looking to create this alliance so cops can get help.

Critical Aspects Podcast (38:07.242)

Yeah, I got a lot of spare time.

Tim Rutledge (38:17.598)

And if you have an existing team and want to join up with us, absolutely you're welcome. And because we'd love to have your bodies too. You've got cops that have been through stuff that we haven't been through. So, uh, the Alliance is just that. We want to, we want to join up and, and make this thing bigger and broader, uh, so cops can get help.

Critical Aspects Podcast (38:39.322)

Absolutely. So, and before we close, I want to say that I thank you for being on here, being a part and for really pushing this change to be available to not just in a critical incident, but just for everyday struggles that law enforcement officers face, that those who, you know, even first responders face, because you have had some firefighters come through your class and-

Even the ones that we've done, they've come back twice.

Tim Rutledge (39:11.578)

I'm sorry, I thought you said first responders and firefighter in the same sentence. I'm sorry. I can't hear. My connection must be bad. I'm kidding. Of course. I love. Yeah, I love firefighters.

Critical Aspects Podcast (39:18.755)

It must have been a little fuzzy. But before we go, to where you're at now, how much is your faith and your relationship with God played into that? Played into where you're at now and what you're doing.

Tim Rutledge (39:35.918)

100% he guides and now I don't advertise it that way but God guides this whole program. He guides my daily life 100% and When I do well, it's God when I do poorly it's Tim and it took me a long time to learn that I'm an expert in telling you how not to do peer support because I screwed it up when I got it, right But I've learned to let go and let God and when that happens life is really good

Critical Aspects Podcast (39:52.471)

Yep.

Critical Aspects Podcast (40:05.022)

Good. Well, Tim, I appreciate it. Appreciate you taking the time and jump on here. So hopefully, through this, that there's others that have heard what you've been saying and will look up what Leaps is doing and they'll just start making a change where they're at. So I appreciate it.

Tim Rutledge (40:20.514)

Well, thank you for your ministry. Thank you for your passion. By the way, everybody, Vern shares my passion. It's probably more passionate about cops than I am. So reach out to him. He is the real deal. I wouldn't be, this is the first podcast I've done ever outside of a little local thing for one agency. You can trust Vern, he's genuine. So reach out to him.

Critical Aspects Podcast (40:46.476)

I appreciate that. Thank you, Tim.

Tim Rutledge (40:49.238)

All right, brother. We'll talk soon. Take care.

Critical Aspects Podcast (40:50.218)

All right. We'll see you.